Deal reached on property tax relief; some caps won't apply in St. Joseph County

by Samuel King (king@wsbt.com)

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Indiana lawmakers will vote on a property tax relief and restructuring plan before the session ends

Indiana lawmakers will vote on a property tax relief and restructuring plan before the session ends at midnight on Friday March 14, 2008. (WSBT photo)

By Beth Boehne

INDIANAPOLIS — The deal is almost done! Indiana lawmakers are set to vote on property tax reform.

After more than two months of negotiation, leaders in the state House and Senate have reached an agreement on property tax reform.

It would cut property taxes by an average of 29 percent statewide, but the plan could mean less savings for homeowners in St. Joseph County.

"We have two parties in Indiana and they have the governor and the Senate, so we have to compromise," said House Speaker Pat Bauer.

The plan would cap taxes at 1 percent of a home's assessed value for residential property, 2 percent for rental property and farmland and 3 percent for commercial property.

The catch for property owners in St. Joseph and Lake counties, is the cap on the taxes that pay for government debt service on things like school construction would be eliminated.

That means taxpayers in those counties could see somewhat less savings than homeowners in other counties.

Bauer said that was absolutely necessary because those counties have so much debt and would have lost too much revenue under the tax plan.

"You can call it whatever you want, but it meant that they would be able to pay their bill and not declare bankruptcy," Bauer said. "The state of Indiana should not force local governments to declare bankruptcy."

Republicans had reservations about that provision and other parts of the bill as well.

"I'm not 100 percent satisfied with it, because I don't personally like the phase in aspect. But that's what we're potentially going to get with the permanent caps going into effect in 2010," said Rep. Tim Neese of Elkhart.

But Bauer says with the state taking on responsibility for welfare, juvenile justice and some school costs, everyone will see real tax savings.

"There's a lot of different ways that we're cutting all property taxes. So some people might be blinded by some other adjustments and they're losing focus of the tremendous cuts there are in this bill," Bauer said.

The House adjourned for the night just before 11 on Thursday. That means any final vote on the property tax plan will happen Friday. Stay with WSBT News on air and online for continuing property tax reform coverage.

Thursday, Mar 27 at 1:06 PM tax paying 101 wrote ...

We will get your money by any means. Move out of St. Joes County, o-yeah you can't sell your house, becasue no one will want to move into St. Joes County. We will just get hit twice by paying more and more taxes as the sales tax increase is still coming to this county as well as increased property taxes. Way to go Team St. Joe!! We really have leaders in this county, leading the way in taking everything that we have.

Saturday, Mar 15 at 3:48 PM christine wrote ...

move to elkhart much nicer then st joe

Saturday, Mar 15 at 8:43 AM Larry wrote ...

It's time to move out of this armpit called South Bend. Too bad its impossible to sell a house here, as there are no job, high crime, poor weather, etc...

Friday, Mar 14 at 9:57 PM Poor Tax Payer wrote ...

I say let the county file for bankruptcy then a federal judge gets to tell the county how to spend the money, and vote out all the current administration for mismanagement of tax payers money.

Friday, Mar 14 at 9:28 PM POWER OF THE PEOPLE wrote ...

COME ON PEOPLE MISHAWAKA NEEDS MORE PARKS , RESTAURANTS , SHOPPING CENTERS , UNDERPASSES , AND VACANT HOMES!!! HOW MANY INDUSTRIAL JOBS HAVE LEFT THE AREA ? THE PEOPLE ARE NEXT!!! THIS WILL BE THE MOST ANTICIPATED ELECTION NEXT TIME, LESS TAX REVENUE LESS SAFETY IS THAT A THREAT ???

Friday, Mar 14 at 9:08 PM TAKE WHAT YOU NEED wrote ...

ST JOE PROPERTY VALUES HAVE ALL DROPPED PRIOR TO THIS ,LIKE MOST OF THE COUNTRY HAS. DOES THIS MEAN AFTER VALUES CONTINUE TO DROP AFTER SUCH AN IRONED OUT TAX REFORM OUR 08 TAX ASSESSMENTS PAYABLE 09 WILL BE LOWER ? LESS THEN A WEEK BEFORE THE DEAD LINE AND THIS DUAL COUNTY TAKE IT IN THE CAN PROPOSAL IS INTRODUCED ? LESS TIME TO ARGUE WITH THEM .

Friday, Mar 14 at 5:23 PM Marge wrote ...

I don't understand why South Bend is in such financial straits, moreso than other counties in Indiana. But then, we have had only Democrats in power for many many years. Time for a change??

Friday, Mar 14 at 2:30 PM pam wrote ...

Ok our taxes went up really high this past year our county got a lot more money then before, if we go the way the governor wants we will be right where we were before the tax hike, come on representatives you worked fine on that before why not now, I know you got used the the extra money from last year and do not want to lose it now, stop being greedy. Lets vote everyone of these representatives out the next time we vote and get someone in here that will listen to us for a change.

Friday, Mar 14 at 1:59 PM Candy wrote ...

Why should the politicians care, they all have enough money, they dont have to worry about loosing their homes like some of us do.

Friday, Mar 14 at 1:48 PM Jeff wrote ...

Man, I was all fired up that Spring, warm weather, and some small hope for property tax relief was here, but after reading these comments and this news story, I think I want to move to Alabama and pump gas for $6.00/hr. It is a shame the local city/county government has a free ticket to overspend, but if I overspend, I lose my cable, phone, electric, gas, internet, trash service, cell phone, car and home. I guess the only thing we can do is vote to get these people out of office in SB and IND.

Friday, Mar 14 at 1:09 PM Pat wrote ...

I hope Mr. Bauer enjoys his last term. We the tax payers can't afford the good old politic game they are playing. Let's try something new government for the people by the people, wait I thought we already had that. We will the next election. At least Tim Neese has the guts to stand up for us tax payers.

Friday, Mar 14 at 12:09 PM Harley wrote ...

Bauer needs to take on his responsibilities to represent the taxpayers of South Bend / Northern Indiana.Get off your"duff" at your Ivy Tech office and answer your phone calls from your constituents.(as you say that you will not take phone calls)Who elected you? Please everyone call and voice your disatisfaction. Oh, by the way when the Toll Road was sold everyone in Indiana got a "piece of the pie". So Why is St. Joe County in this all alone ? Come on everyone dump these politicians!

Friday, Mar 14 at 11:52 AM Great wrote ...

So I guess Mayor Steve and Mayor Jeff will be out of a job in 4 years. Along with the Commissioners. It is amazing they cannot control there spending. So all of the homeowners do not get there fair share of the tax relief. I would be on the phone. This is very unfair. How sad.

Friday, Mar 14 at 10:52 AM get real wrote ...

let the law suits begin. this will make a whole lot of lawyers rich.

Friday, Mar 14 at 10:51 AM Fed Up wrote ...

Simply put, we are moving. The money we are paying in taxes is not worth the services we are getting. I see these services getting worse rather than better.

Friday, Mar 14 at 10:37 AM Nick wrote ...

The problem is our leaders have mismanaged our tax revenue. South Bend has alot higher bond debt.

Friday, Mar 14 at 10:13 AM Fred wrote ...

This is a cover-up to hide the debt they have put the county in. You notice noone is talking about it. How much does the county really owe? There are probably things hidden that they don't want the public to know about.

Friday, Mar 14 at 9:32 AM Will wrote ...

I like the tea Idea for St Patricks Day. Lets organize a boston Tea protest party. Protest at the citys St. Patricks day party

Friday, Mar 14 at 9:00 AM Anonymous wrote ...

If this is passed, I give up trying to keep my home. Who wants a home appraised (and taxed) at $122K? I owe about $95K. Just take over the mortgage.

Friday, Mar 14 at 8:55 AM Janet wrote ...

Isn;t it amazing that every other county in Indiana except St Joseph and Lake can work with their budges. But then again maybe they arent' spending money building condo's along the river, building new motels that aren't needed, and funding millions of dollards in projects that are a waste to the regular taxpayer.

Friday, Mar 14 at 8:51 AM Anonymous wrote ...

Will, maybe we should go upstream and dump green tea in the river for St. Patrick's day.

Friday, Mar 14 at 8:49 AM Anonymous wrote ...

"All men [counties] are created equal, but some men [counties] are more equal than others." Bauer does kind of look like one of the pigs, doesn't he?

Friday, Mar 14 at 8:33 AM jeff wrote ...

Keep voting for the same people year after year and this is what you get.

Friday, Mar 14 at 8:16 AM tax poor wrote ...

What are we getting from our government.....well we all need to roll over and have a cigarette..... I know they are !! Was it good for you??????

Friday, Mar 14 at 7:37 AM Jerry wrote ...

Government for the people by the people.........or at least, depending where you live,some of the people. Our politicians have lost touch.

Friday, Mar 14 at 7:24 AM Mike wrote ...

Can anyone explain the real reason why Lake and St Joe Counties are in Debt so severly that we would have to pay more?Hell if the Home market wasn'nt in the toilet no one in their right mind would stay in these two counties.

Friday, Mar 14 at 1:03 AM Nick wrote ...

Anybody know what the rules are for starting a recall election for our state congressman. I would think it would have to start out as a petition, then a vote to recall our so called leaders. Its time to have Dvorak and Bauer removed.

Friday, Mar 14 at 12:39 AM Kenny wrote ...

Lake and St. Joseph county don't get to vote for their judges, now they don't get the property tax relief? Does someone see a pattern here? The value of my home is falling and my property taxes rose nearly 50% last year. I can't believe how unfair and crooked this is. Somebody needs to get a grip down state and stop this nonsense. Goodnight Irene

Friday, Mar 14 at 12:35 AM rick wrote ...

i live in south bend and my property takes are 1000 $ and i am fine with that why sould i have to pay more in the long run for people who cant afford there taxes its bs.if u cant afford it then move. but i do agree that our indiana gov spends way to much money and take to much of it from us in more ways then one. what ever happened to that multibillion dollar tollroad sale we havent seen any of that especially in our roads that need much needed repair time for a new government!!!!!!!!!!!!

Thursday, Mar 13 at 11:08 PM Tami wrote ...

I can't understand why anyone would vote for Pat Bauer.

Thursday, Mar 13 at 11:00 PM Susan wrote ...

The majority of you missed a chance for change when you didn't elect Manigault. That was a lifeline. What also is not mentioned is if they decided to raise our local income taxes as they had discussed a few weeks ago. Our County gov. needs to stop enacting laws we cannot afford to enforce. And by the way, last fall there was an efficiency report in the Tribune that recommended the City stop letting employees move their cars during work hours. Did that happen? I can find a parking space....

Thursday, Mar 13 at 10:51 PM Todd wrote ...

$5000 in taxes a year with Mishawaka High School hovering at a 55% graduation rate means another $5000 for Marian High School. Property taxes are too high. We don't get what we pay for.

Thursday, Mar 13 at 10:02 PM Chad wrote ...

The Mishawaka and South Bend mayor got just what they asked for. This is highway robery!

Thursday, Mar 13 at 9:59 PM Frank wrote ...

Call and complain or send an email to those doing this to us. Tell them we won't stand for this, the governor said that this bill has to be fair to EVERYONE!

Thursday, Mar 13 at 9:38 PM Anonymous wrote ...

Rea and Luecke, you better resign. We will be relentless in getting rid of you.

Thursday, Mar 13 at 9:36 PM Jordan wrote ...

We all need to write to those who are screwing us. I can't believe that Gov. Daniels would allow this to happen. He said it would be fair and equal!!

Thursday, Mar 13 at 9:34 PM victor wrote ...

St Joe county Is spending way too much take it away form them and they will adjust they will boo hoo for a while. I moved out of st joe county because of it. but my 85000 dollr house didnt sell quickly due to high property taxes and they socked me with 4500 dollars property tax for 1.5 years. This is insane. If they would go back to neighborhood schools and quit shipping kids all over the city to maintain some racial balance they wouldn teed as much money to run a school. Every body sell house.

Thursday, Mar 13 at 9:26 PM Timothy Taylor wrote ...

Remember this at election time-if any incumbent from St Joe county voted for this they will not get my vote- Democrat or Republican.

Thursday, Mar 13 at 9:22 PM Walkerton wrote ...

So we are going to get hit twice? Once for the higher property tax and once for the higher sales tax that is part of the deal. Or did they exempt St. Joe County from the sales tax? HA HA Does the timing of all this seem strange? That night before they go home. Tough to contact your rep on such short notice. Political games. Everyone who votes for or approves this plan should be voted out of office, including Mitch, Jackie, Bauer, Dvorak, etc.

Thursday, Mar 13 at 9:18 PM Frank wrote ...

The people of this county get what they deserve; voting consistently for the same self-serving incompetent politicians just because they're Democrats ( and I'm a life long Democrat). For heaven's sake, people, wake up and start making some NOISE! The media needs to allow the grass roots be heard.

Thursday, Mar 13 at 9:14 PM frustrated wrote ...

term limits in the state and in the US Congress sound good about now.

Thursday, Mar 13 at 9:13 PM JT wrote ...

We need a sign in front of the Welcome to "insert city name here" Open your wallets and give to the two Mayoral Thevies. And we think thee is a problem with banks being robbed we have ELECTED suits now doing it. I hope people really remember this at next election. Wait, the other theif will want to rerun for the next Mayor might as well re-elect that liar Kern back into office since steve already has him kissing his butt!!!

Thursday, Mar 13 at 8:55 PM commish wrote ...

I am shocked if its good for the rest of the state the the two mentioned counties should be included.

Thursday, Mar 13 at 8:52 PM Dennis wrote ...

Boston Tea Paty - Remember that...I didnt vote for these clowns and as far as I am concerned, I am not getting my fair representation.

Thursday, Mar 13 at 8:48 PM Al wrote ...

And just who is responsible for the supposedly larger government debt in St Joseph and Lake counties-let me guess-Homeowners!-I think not! Can you say -"we are leaving!"

Thursday, Mar 13 at 8:44 PM Anonymous wrote ...

Move to niles. nice and quiet up here..for the most part. Yeah, everyone makes fun of our numerous dirt roads in michigan, but I can gurantee ya, my ride to work on my dirt road is alot smoother than your ride to work on your paved. What a shame. My home sits on half acre..I pay roughly $600 a year in taxes. Thats pretty sweet.

Thursday, Mar 13 at 8:35 PM Dave wrote ...

Just one more reason to move out of this county.

Thursday, Mar 13 at 8:30 PM Joe wrote ...

That Just Goes to show what my Grandfather used to Say. If Indiana were a Cow, South Bend would be the part right under the Tail.

Thursday, Mar 13 at 8:26 PM Sporty wrote ...

That's what a good Democrat does,spend your money! You just reelected the guy,so enjoy! Which county has had alot of tax problems? St Joe. So which county gets the shaft once again? St Joe! Glad I don't live there and feel sorry for those of you who do. As a Republican myself,I can't wait to vote our Gov out of office for screwing up the time change deal! We should all be on one time and I hope that gets put on the ballot. So Dem or Rep,we get the shaft no matter. Gov has failed ....

Thursday, Mar 13 at 8:22 PM Debbie wrote ...

Unconstitutional! I can not believe that this is happening. I pay almost $5000.00 a year on a house valued at $115,000.00. It is easy to see why there are so many homes in St. Joe county that are selling for $1.00. If our local government was able to see that if people are deserting their homes and you don't get tax money from a deserted home. Look at the decline in the population in South Bend. And Mishawaka is busy spending money on Sportscenters, ugly buildings that ruin the riverwalk area!

Thursday, Mar 13 at 8:20 PM okay wrote ...

Well I'm moving out of Indiana, so who cares.

Thursday, Mar 13 at 8:17 PM Fred wrote ...

Can we hope that it gets vetoed? The governor did say they would stay in session until they come up with one he approves.

Thursday, Mar 13 at 8:10 PM Quinn wrote ...

Will we still be subject to the hike in sales tax that was suppose to be part of the proposal?

Thursday, Mar 13 at 8:08 PM Morgan Thomas wrote ...

Try selling your house now. Looks like St Joseph County will become a ghost county.

Thursday, Mar 13 at 8:05 PM Walkerton wrote ...

Where is our representation at? St. Joseph county pays more because the Mayors cannot run an effecient administration. And because of our tax abatement give away program. Cut abatements, take home cars, overstaffed hwy crews, conferences and trips, and over staffing. Run the gov't like a real business and stop whining. I cannot wait until the next election. Good by local leaders and the reps down state that sold us out.

Thursday, Mar 13 at 7:58 PM Tom wrote ...

We need an election to recall Mayor Luecke.

Thursday, Mar 13 at 7:53 PM David Kahlmorgan wrote ...

At least they did not get the option tax they were talking about in St. Joe county. Most people do not realize what they were trying to pull over on the citizens in this county. A 2% option tax on a persons salary would have been about triple what most people are paying now on there homes. The politcians in this county are nothing but a bunch of crooks, and you can put my name on that.

Thursday, Mar 13 at 7:47 PM John wrote ...

Move to Elkhart

Thursday, Mar 13 at 7:44 PM Concerned Citizen wrote ...

What is wrong with this picture. . .The bureaucrats are destroying our county. Not only will we pay higher property taxes, the "value" of our homes will be negatively impacted. The Governor needs to intercede to ensure fair and equitable treatment for "ALL" of the citizens of Indiana!!!!

Thursday, Mar 13 at 7:43 PM Chuck wrote ...

What a joke! St. Joe and Lake county residents deserve the same property tax relief as the other 90 counties. Evidently Allen, Marion and the rest of the big counties can operate more efficiently than St. Joe and Lake Counties. As long as the same politicians are elected in this county spending will continue to increase with no regard to the tax payers. Vote the incumbents out! We should be able to vote for judges like the rest of the state as well.

Thursday, Mar 13 at 7:39 PM Jerry wrote ...

This is what happens when people like Luecke and Bauer are in office too long. We are the wellfare county along with lake and it is costing us. I'm moving first chance I get...

Thursday, Mar 13 at 7:38 PM Jim wrote ...

Nice

Thursday, Mar 13 at 7:36 PM Gifford wrote ...

Here's one solution: Vote them out of office at their next election. Simple as that.

Thursday, Mar 13 at 7:24 PM Nick wrote ...

Walk away from your upside down, high property tax homes

Thursday, Mar 13 at 7:13 PM Jim wrote ...

Holy crap. South Bend has one of the highest foreclosure rates mainly because of high property taxes. It has the worst school system in the state. We have city and state reps that differently than the wishes of the people. Why live in this city?

Thursday, Mar 13 at 7:03 PM mark wrote ...

If this doesn't encourage the residents of South Bend and St. Joe county to vote out anyone who votes for this bill, I'm not sure what will. Don't forget that to make up the lost revenue from taxes, the plan is to raise the sales tax. So, not only do we not get lower property taxes, we pay the higher sales tax as well. Thanks Bauer for taking care of your buddy and ignoring the plight of the common person. Please Mr. Governor veto this bill if it passes and save us in St. Joe county from it.

Thursday, Mar 13 at 6:58 PM Will wrote ...

This is the kind of stuff that resulted in a thing called the Boston Tea Party! Pathetic.

Thursday, Mar 13 at 6:38 PM Mike wrote ...

UNBELIEVABLE!!! The rest of the state gets true property tax relief and we here in St. Joe get only partial relief? This is unconstitutional!! Congrats Mayors Steve and Jeff, you have just made living here in St Joe county undesirable. Who is going to want to live in a county where taxes are proportionally unfair compared to the neighboring counties!! I hope everyone remembers this when the next election rolls around.

Thursday, Mar 13 at 6:37 PM Speed1953 wrote ...

WHAT are our local representatives thinking ?

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